September 27, 2007

"We're no longer subpar to Colorado, Arizona, Nevada, and Idaho...So therefore our ways of compensating teachers ought to be commensurate with theirs, too." -Gov Huntsman

KEN VERDOIA, KUED: Governor, thank you for joining us this morning. Starting now with a serious question, the escape of two inmates that are still at large as we meet on this Thursday morning. The escape of these two convicted murderers from a rural county jail in Utah has focused attention of many Utahns for the first time on the fact that this state uses county jails in a very large number of cases to house state prison inmates. Is it time to rethink placing these 1200 state prison inmates in county jails, and is it time for a major reinvestment in bed space in the state prison system?

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: It's a very good question, and I think it's fair to say that it's time to take a look, as we are doing, at the operating standards at the county facilities, particularly Daggett county, where the escape took place. And we are doing that. Tom Patterson is working with all of the facilities with which we have a relationship‑‑and there are about 20 of them‑‑and we figure there are probably 1523 inmates who are in county facilities. And this has been ongoing for many, many years, as you know. This has been the way that we've handled prisoners who have earned the right to transition to a medium security facility, and that's basically what the operating practice has been for a good many years.

We need to take a look at what happened at Daggett, and in fact, we are taking a look at what happened at Daggett. It is on lockdown currently. We have taken, I think, four or five serious offenders, murderers back to the Draper facility, and we're going to want a full review as to why that happened. We have to remember that the growth rate in our prison system requires about, I'm guessing, $100 million per year.

If we look at the natural population growth over the years to come, which is to say about 250, 275 beds per year that would be required, that's kind of the underlying growth rate assumption that we look at, that's a significant cost to the state. So we've got to keep that in mind, expansion, we're going to be expanding Gunnison. I've been down there most recently, I've looked at a couple of pods that they'll be expanding at that facility.

But the relationship with the counties has been going for some time. And it's worked out reasonably well, and I think we have to say over all the practice has been good, and we haven't had any other such incidents that I can think of, and we're going to want to take a good look at what happened in Daggett, and we're going to want a full report. I want a full report, I know all citizens want a full report as to what happened. Along with ensuring that what is happening with all of the 20 other facilities with which we contract that are the, the practices are in keeping with the standards that everyone fully realizes ought to be in place.

RICHARD PIATT, KSL 5: Well Governor, when you were running for election, you were proposing a whole new prison, and doing away with the Draper facility.

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: That's right.

RICHARD PIATT, KSL 5: This incident, combined with the audit earlier this year, perhaps combined with what happened to the corrections officer here at the University of Utah earlier this year, does this give you an opportunity, maybe, to reintroduce this proposal?

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: Well, it's a dangerous business. I think we have to remember that, first and foremost. And I think second, we have a pretty good record as a state. I think that ought to be sort of an underlying feature in everything we do and talk about. As it relates to the Draper facility, I've always argued that at some point the cost that we can recoup for the land on which that site is located will allow us to build a better facility, a more up‑to‑date facility. And the one we have there is circa 1952. At some point in time. Now the last numbers I took a look at were not yet there in terms of what it would cost, then, to make the move and to build something new in another facility. I'm not willing to take a loss on it, but there will be a point in time where those lines will cross, where we'll actually be able to raise enough from the sale of land, if that's, in fact, what we want to do, for purposes of building another facility.

RICHARD PIATT, KSL 5: So you're interested in the long‑term implications of a new facility, as opposed to, you know, the concerns that we're dealing with right now about security.

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: Well, right now we need to make sure that the relationships with places like Daggettt County are based on sound, safe standards that everyone recognizes are representative of best practices. Now, something happened there, and we've got to understand what happened, and deal with that. The relationships that we've got with the 20 other facilities seem to be fine, and they have been for many, many years. This is a significant cost area when we start expanding beyond our natural rate of growth. And at some point we will be building a new facility. I can't tell you when that time will come, but we will be there. I want to be able to justify it from a cost standpoint, however.

CHRIS VANOCUR, ABC 4: Governor, switching gears a little bit. When it comes to Crandall Canyon mine, there were questions before about what the feds did with the mine. There were certainly questions during the rescue effort, and now the labor department will not share information with your mine safety commission. If you're down in Utah's coal country, when it comes to this matter, can they really trust the U.S. government now?

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: You have to remember, we have a representative, Sherry Hiyashi from our labor commission, who is a part of the MSHA inspection that is ongoing, which will serve our state's purposes longer term, whenever that investigation is wrapped up, and it could take a year. I am concerned, and I think Scott Matheson shares this concern, that we're not getting the updates in real time that might help him and his committee. I'm going to ask for greater cooperation, I will be called back to testify before the house labor and education committee on the 3rd of October, and I will likely bring up this issue. Similarly, I will be sending a letter to secretary Chao, asking for greater collaboration. All we're looking for is sharing, in real time, information that might be helpful to our state efforts.

CHRIS VANOCUR, ABC 4: You're being ever the diplomat, here. That was your political answer. Personally, you're not happy that they're not handing this stuff over.

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: Oh, I think‑ ‑ Well, let me then put it in different terms. I think there ought to be a much closer working relationship between MSHA and what our state safety commission is doing. That isn't working, for whatever reason, and that's against certain assurances that I had early on that we would be working collaboratively, and there would be shared information on an ongoing basis, and I'm going to be asking why that isn't the case, and what needs to be done in order to change that.

CHRIS VANOCUR, ABC 4: They should be handing the stuff over to the state.

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: Well, they should be giving us real‑time briefings on what it is. Now, there may be some things that are compartmentalized for reasons that are based on a criminal investigation or something that otherwise would be highly sensitive in nature, and I'm sure that, you know, sharing that with Scott Matheson, who is the chairman of our mine safety commission, good minds can determine what information is useful to a working group versus that which must remain compartmentalized for investigative purposes. And all that I will be asking for is a connection that can be made between the MSHA effort and our mine safety commission effort. They can then determine, you know, once they get the information if it helps our own state effort. If it does, that's a good use of information. If it's information that shouldn't go beyond, then that decision, too, can be made.

LISA RILEY ROCHE, DESERET MORNING NEWS: But governor, the labor secretary suggested in his letter to Scott Matheson, the chairman of your mine safety commission.

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: The solicitor, yes. The acting solicitor.

LISA RILEY ROCHE, DESERET MORNING NEWS: Right, and to copy to you, that sharing that information with the commission the way it's set up would actually compromise the federal government's investigation, that there's a mine industry representative on the commission that you created, and others that might well end up being a subject or connected to subjects of this investigation. Do you have concerns that pushing this request from the state will somehow compromise the federal government's efforts?

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: No, I don't think so at all. We have outstanding people involved in the mine safety commission effort. Moreover, we have John Basa, who is a state representative, and if there were concerns with the committee members themselves, John could certainly play a role above and beyond that as our state representative.

We're just asking for a connection here so that there is a flow of information that might help our efforts. So the efforts don't become duplicative, we're not doing something that is already being done, wasting time and resources. And I think a simple, periodic spot check will allow us to at least share information, pool information in ways that I think would be helpful for both groups. And I believe they did this with West Virginia, by the way. I think there was a little more in the way of openness and collaboration with west Virginia.

GLEN WARCHOL, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: Could you help the situation by removing the industry representative from your commission? Would that perhaps open the communication lines better, since that was a point that they made?

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: I don't think we're going to have to go that far. I don't think that that is necessarily a material point, here. West Virginia had a representative of industry. I think whenever you have a working group, it's important to achieve a balance, and I think we have a pretty good balance on this working group. We have united mine workers, we have industry, we have local elected officials, so on, so forth. I think it's more a function of figuring out how best to ensure those connections in ways that both sides have some confidence with, and clearly we're not there, but I'm hoping that in future communications we can establish something that is a little more productive and helpful.

GLEN WARCHOL, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: And another aspect of the commission's work, it's the community meetings. The community has been lukewarm to the idea of the state being somehow involved in mine safety regulation. Is this something that has surprised you? Is this going to change the direction of the commission?

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: No, I think the commission pretty much has its objectives set, it understands its purpose, and I think we would be derelict in our duties as elected officials representing the state, if we didn't do this. And I realize that there are differing opinions, but I think, all in all, when people realize that the focus is first and foremost worker safety, that there aren't going to be too many complaints. Nobody is looking at robbing the industry of opportunities. There is nothing underhanded at all toward the coal industry. It's been a part of who we are for a long time, and it will be for generations to come.

All we're looking for is how we might altogether somehow enhance safety in the work place, and we don't know yet what the recommendations going to be. We're going to hear soon, and we'll then deal realistically with those recommendations.

RICHARD PIATT, KSL 5: Governor, if I could switch gears once again. The voucher issue is just now starting to heat up, ads are starting to run, pressure is mounting. You signed the voucher bill earlier this year, yet you have not come out, and I'm sure you've been lobbied to come out in favor of the referendum or for voting yes. What are your feelings about coming out and making a statement about the voucher referendum at this point?

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: Well, it depends what you mean by "coming out." If, by "coming out," you address it whenever you're asked, as I have, on television, on radio, in public speeches, which I think is the responsible way to handle it as governor, or do you come out in special interest ads that are paid for by one side or the other? I'm not sure that is the responsible way to do it. I'm handling it as I think a governor should in these circumstances. In other words, doing everything but becoming the poster child for a set of ads. And I'm encouraging people wherever I go to basically get smart on the issue, telling them why I signed it and why I will vote for it. I think it's a nice weapon to have in our arsenal that will affect maybe one or two percent of our student population in allowing them a little more mobility and flexibility in choosing other programs, if, in fact, what we have in the public system doesn't suit them.

My kids are all in public schools and they all learn a little bit differently and I can see how some, particularly at the lower ends of the economic spectrum, where they didn't have a lot of options, might be able to find something that is better for their child under those circumstances.

And I'm asking people simply to get smart on the issue. You know, get beyond the rhetoric and just learn the issues for yourself, and see where you come down on it and then cast a vote in November. That's, I think, what a governor ought to be doing, and I'm doing my best to play that role.

BROCK VERGAKIS, ASSOCIATED PRESS: Isn't that kind of a passive approach, though?

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: Well, it depends what you mean bypass sieve. I'm sure there are some out there who think I'm way too engaged. I have to find the balance that I think suits the office, and suits my overall objectives, and I have many objectives as it relates to education. We'll have a voucher vote in November, but let us not forget that there are a multiplicity of education‑related issues that we all need to be involved in, that are going to serve us long term. Yesterday I visited three different school districts. I was in Daggett county, I was in Roosevelt, and I was in Vernal, and met with dozens and dozens of teachers and principals and administrators and parents and school board members, and we have some very important issues that we need to rally around in this state.

You know, vouchers is one of them, and we'll have a vote in November. But we have others, for example, like teacher compensation, that is woefully inadequate in this state. We have things like testing requirements that are also indequate in this statement. We do too much of it, by the way, and it takes teacher time away from doing what they do best in the class room. We're looking at that, and by November 13th, when we have our public ed summit, we're going to have a recommendation on what the appropriate level of testing is in the state.

And that just begins the list of things that we need to really focus on if we're going to make sure that we have the best practices public ed system in the country. And I'm a little bit tired of people saying that there ought to be a discount factor in this state in terms of compensation, because our economy just isn't what our neighboring states are. Well, that's an anachronism that whole argument. We're no longer subpar to Colorado, Arizona, Nevada, and Idaho. We're better than they are economically, and we're certainly in their class in every possible way to measure economic performance. So therefore our ways of compensating teachers ought to be commensurate with theirs, too. And it isn't. We're behind five, $8,000 on average.

So there are a lot of important battles ahead, and let's remember that we need to stay focused on, at least if you're governor, in my seat, on all of them in order to ensure that we do the very best we can for our kids going forward.

GLEN WARCHOL, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: Governor Huntsman, just to go over this one more time, many people that are supportive of vouchers, that are involved in this, feel that you've abandoned them, that they're looking at a very hard fight, things are not looking optimistic now, and they really want you to come out as a poster child in ads, things like that. The argument might be, in for a dime, in for a dollar. You signed the bill, where are you now? You've disappeared? You're AWOL.

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: Well, I am everywhere I am asked the question. Right here, for example. Speeches today, speeches yesterday, on the radio, I think that's a ridiculous argument on the part of other people that I'm AWOL. I talk about it wherever I'm asked. I think that probably underplays to a certain extent the multiplicity of educational issues that, as governor, you have to manage.

LISA RILEY ROCHE, DESERET MORNING NEWS: It sounds, though, governor, as if you're saying if we don't get vouchers, okay, there are a lot of other ways we could improve education that we ought to also be focusing on, even now as we're having this big debate going into the election. Is that a fair‑ ‑

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: Vouchers is one aspect of, I think, improving education. And if we achieve it in November, I think it would serve this state in ways that are good and positive. If it is voted down, there probably will be another battle around the corner. Hard to know where that goes ultimately. But it's been talked about for at least ten years so far as I can tell, and you have people who think it's good, and people who don't think it's good. Well, everybody has a chance now to vote in November, to get smart about the issue, and cast a vote based upon what you think is right for the state. I know what I'm going to do, I'm going to vote in favor of it. I don't hesitate to tell people that.

The only thing I haven't done is to become an ad pitch person for one particular side of the debate. And I've said, I think, for many months, with many of you here, that that was my choice because of the many things a governor has to be involved with, early on, and that continues to be my‑ ‑

RICHARD PIATT, KSL 5: Are you getting pressure to be the pitch person, or are the pro‑voucher people approaching you actively?

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: No.

KEN VERDOIA, KUED: Governor, let me broaden this discussion a little bit, because there was an allegation made in a public meeting by a state representative that a quid pro quo is emerging, that if you and others, business leaders, want health care reform, those business leaders need to fall in on the voucher issue and become more active and put their weight behind passing the voucher issue. Have you heard these allegations of the so‑called quid pro quo, support one or lose the other?

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: No, I've only heard these allegations from third‑party representatives. I've never heard them directly from anybody. And I can't imagine that I would. I can't imagine that too many people in the business community would. If you can track down the source, you know, I'd be interested in knowing. But November is going to be the time where people vote on vouchers, that will then determine where the whole debate goes.

The health care debate, I think, is picking up a lot of steam and momentum. And I think this year in the legislature, for me it's going to be a priority. I think for certain legislators it's going to be a priority. It will probably take the next 2‑3 years, if we're really going to do it right, in terms of covering a good many of our 360,000 who are uninsured in the state, which I think is a noble objective, and one that I think is imminently doable if we all pull together under the banner of the United Way, which really is what has happened so far.

They've done a very, very good job in bringing stake holders together, I probably consider myself one of them, and it's been discussed in some detail in terms of what it's going to take in order to get this done. And I do sense that we, as a state, could pull off something that many thought many years ago would have been absolutely impossible.

JULIE ROSE, KCPW: One of the proposals, the recommendations in that proposal is that all Utahns be required to have health insurance of some sort, and those who are not able to afford it would be paid for by the state through one of the state's health programs. It's a mandate of health insurance. Are you comfortable with that, with requiring every Utahn to get health insurance?

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: I'm comfortable with a requirement, you can call it whatever you want, but at some point we're going to have to get serious about how we deal with this issue, and that means there will have to be a multitude of different policies that are available in the marketplace. It means that it will be incumbent upon citizens to look more at responsibility, their own responsibility in terms of health and the choices that are made. It likely will mean that we'll be in an environment with better prices, more options, more access and availability.

There is a mandate today, let us not forget, and it's called the emergency room. And you show up at the emergency room and you get covered. And who pays the bills? Taxpayers pay the bills. Companies pay the bills. So we're living today in an environment, to be sure, where there already is a mandate in place. It's whether you want to really make the system more efficient in a world where you've got to figure that 50 percent, maybe more than 50 percent of the procedures that are used today are maybe unnecessary or superfluous, which infuses a lot of unnecessary costs into the system. I won't even‑ ‑

As somebody who can afford to pay, or cover health care, I wouldn't even begin to tell you the stories of what I have learned over the summer with a son who broke his leg, with shoulder surgery that I had, with a daughter who had a pulmonary embolism, we were sitting Sunday night going through at least 25 different bills that have come in. And anyone who goes through this, it's a huge eye‑opener in terms of costs, in terms of what really are the options that maybe we could have chosen, or could have done away with, that added to the overall cost?

We have an opportunity to do something very unique and novel, here. In covering our population, in squeezing costs out of the system, in harmonizing patient data, like has never been done before in the country, which I think serves the health interests of all of our citizens, and in doing something on the overall health responsibility side, which is taking some responsibility for the choices you make, and therefore the implications of the choices you make, and incentivizing people accordingly.

CHRIS VANOCUR, ABC 4: Governor, your reaction to the decision in the Warren Jeffs case?

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: Well, I said it the other night, and it won't be much different, and that is the legal system works, and I was delighted that there was some redress for brave people who were willing to come out of the shadows and tell their stories, and talk about some of the things that go on in corners of this state, in certain communities, that I think need to be exposed. And the legal system worked. I think that the courage that was on display was remarkable, and I'm very proud that the legal system work, and I think Mark Shurtleff did‑ ‑

BROK VERGAKIS, ASSOCIATED PRESS: Do you think that connection will improve Utah's image to the rest of the world?

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: Well I think it shows that Utah and Arizona both are doing something about this. And they're looking at whether it's child abuse, whether it's welfare fraud, they're tackling the issue in ways that are more aggressive than ever before. And I think that's a good thing.

LISA RILEY ROCHE, DESERET MORNING NEWS: Does it send a message that the state is going to have a larger role in confronting polygamy, as we move forward? That this isn't a place where it's welcome?

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: Well I think the attorney general, what he's done so far, would suggest that there is a stepped‑up effort on his part, and a very targeted and focused effort that so far is proving to be successful. And I think that's good news for the state. I think it's good news for those who are willing to come out of the corners and out of the shadows, and talk about the kind of intolerance and illegal behavior that exists in some communities. It might encourage more to come out and have those conversations. Which is a good thing.

KEN VERDOIA, KUED: Governor, we have an awkward one minute left. And I know you're at the early stages of formulating your budget proposal for next year. Can you give us a general outlook on some of the themes that are presenting themselves in these initial considerations of where you want to see state spending to go in the next year?

GOVERNOR HUNTSMAN: Well, we have literally thousands of requests, and line item that is will make up the budget. For me, it's pretty simple this year. I'm going to kind of organize all of them around health systems reform, not just health care reform, but health systems reform as we've kind of touched upon, teacher compensation, because you can talk about it, describe it any way you want, but it comes down to one thing, that we are lacking in this state, that's why we have a 400‑teacher shortage at the beginning of the academic school year. And then three, is air quality.

KEN VERDOIA, KUED: Excellent, governor, thank you very much for your time. We are out of out of that time. Thank you for joining this month on the governors monthly news conference. Good evening.

Return to home page