August 28, 2009

"We ought to be able to keep education held harmless, at least trundling along at the same level that we're doing here today."
- Governor Herbert

DAN BAMMES, KUER FM90: Thanks for being with us today, Governor. Congratulations on assuming this office. The state of Utah has been, now, working under a four-day work week for most of its employees for a year, now, and you are going to have to make a decision on whether that program should be extended. Is the state of Utah achieving its goals with this program, are the efficiencies enough to justify some of the down side, the inconvenience that some people have expressed, and those issues?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: The answer is I don’t know for sure right now. I’ve met with our HR department, they will be giving me a briefing on the facts and figures and the numbers, and we will have to make a review of that, and based on that information we will make a decision before the end of this year. I think we have come up short of the goals that were originally outlined as far as energy savings, and frankly, from my perspective the first priority ought to be service to the public. So that’s an area of concern that I’ve got, is are we providing the service that the public expects? Is there some inconveniences because of Friday closings, not only with the general public but working with local governments, cities, and counties? So as we have information I’ll review it and I will make a decision before the end of the year whether to continue the 4-10 work week or to modify it in some way or do away with it altogether.

DAN BAMMES, KUER FM90: You’re starting now to put together a state budget, and you have to submit it to the legislature in December. What’s your direction now to your department heads? You’re looking at a significant shortfall in state spending, plus no, or at least reduced federal help in putting together the state budget this time. What are you telling your department heads as they begin this process?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, it was a tough budget, our last session. And we will have an equally tough budget this coming session. So the cabinet members, the department heads are certainly aware of that, and they’re having to act accordingly. Looking for those areas of efficiency, those areas that we can save, and some areas that are going to need to be cut. We have a significant hole that needs to be plugged this year, or this coming fiscal year, just like we did last. But we still have intact our rainy day fund. We have $100 million that’s been set aside for education, we have about $418 million in our rainy day fund. I expect that parts of that, if not all of that, will be utilized in trying to plug whatever holes and gaps we have. That, with the savings and efficiencies should allow us to have a balanced budget.

JEFF ROBINSON, KCPW 88.3: Governor, I understand you’re not willing to raise any taxes, even the cigarette tax, which is a directed tax towards a small group of people. Why is that?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, I think raising taxes at a time of economic downturn is absolutely the wrong thing to do. We want to grow the economy. We want to stimulate opportunity in the business community. To put taxes of any kind on top of a depressed market would have, I think, the negative result of actually depressing the economy even more, and stymying the ability for us to turn the corner. Just at a time it looks like that we really are kind of ready to turn the corner. So we wouldn’t want to do something that would depress the economy even worse than it is, and stymy the ability for the economy to recover.

JEFF ROBINSON, KCPW 88.3: But aren’t smokers, cigarette smokers, essentially a relatively small, special interest group in this case?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, I guess we can always target somebody that maybe has no ability to defend their position. But I’m, based on a principle and a philosophy that, you know, let’s empower the private sector. Let’s not punish the private sector, particularly in times of economic uncertainty. So the principles are what are going to guide me, and not the fact that this is somehow politically expedient to do.

LISA RILEY ROCHE, DESERET NEWS: But Governor, the alternative, though, is more severe cuts on top of the cuts that were made last year. And unlike last year, you’re not likely to have hundreds of millions of dollars in federal stimulus money. You’re talking about severe cuts to schools, to human services. How can you justify those, and not raise taxes to kind of offset that blow?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, it’s way premature to even talk about that, for one thing. We don’t even have all the numbers in. I think our projections out of the Governor’s office of planning and budget are pretty accurate, by the way, but we ought to at least wait until we get the number the before we decide what our course of action’s going to be. We had, you know, we’ve got about $514 million of excess money in our rainy day funds and education. So we ought to be able to keep education held harmless, at least trundling along at the same level that we’re doing here today. So I don’t think that we need to think, oh, my gosh, the sky is falling, we need to raise taxes, and then have the counterproductive measure of maybe stifling economic growth. And it would be maybe even worse than it is now. So I’m looking at the long-term outcome. We may have some difficult times right now and some bumps in the road, but let’s not sacrifice for immediate satisfaction for what we need to have on a long-term philosophy of growing the economy.

LISA RILEY ROCHE, DESERET NEWS: But would you feel comfortable using all of the rainy day fund, and all of that $100 million set aside for schools? Lawmakers are saying, let’s not empty out the rainy day fund. Let’s tap just a small part of that in case the economy doesn’t recover as quickly as possible.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Again, like anybody, it’s like your household income and your household budget. It would be probably unwise to have to tap all of your savings account. I understand there’s a balancing act here. We want to make sure we protect our AAA bond rating, and so the appropriate amounts here and there were yet to be determined. But that’s what a rainy day fund is for. And it is raining out there economically, and so we need to consider using that. We were smart in not doing it this past session. Other states wish they were like Utah, with the fiscal foresight and prudence that we’ve exhibited in Utah to be able to try to get through this difficult economic time. I believe we’ll continue in that same vein, we’ll work with the legislature, we’ll find out what’s appropriate based on the numbers, and we’ll make the decisions that are best for Utah’s future.

ROD DECKER, KUTV-2: Besides the duties that the Constitution and statutes provide for the Lieutenant Governor, do you know what else he’s going to be doing for you?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, he’s going to be involved in helping develop policy, number one, as we move forward. Certainly he’s going to be out and about as a part of the face of the executive branch. And an area that he will be, I think, a rock star in, is being a liaison with our legislature. We need to make sure that there’s good communication, and particularly this most difficult time in our state’s history between the executive branch and the legislative branch. I think Senator Greg Bell, soon to be Lieutenant Governor Greg Bell, will be uniquely qualified to make sure that we don’t have misinformation, a good communication, and some kind of collaborative effort as we move forward.

CHRIS VANOCUR, ABC-4: Governor, since this is your first press conference, here’s a bit of a softball. Two-part question.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I appreciate softballs.,P. CHRIS VANOCUR, ABC-4: One, would you kind enough to remind Utahns whether you believe in creationism or Darwinism, and two, do you think both should be taught in Utah schools?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I appreciate that softball, there, Chris. You know, personally, what I believe is probably irrelevant to what the government should be involved with. I’m a devout believer in a supreme being and that God has created the opportunities for us as his children to work together and to learn and progress and I think learn important things here in our mortal existence. That being said, I think school is designed to teach scientific methods, and I think that our state board understands how to create curriculum that’s appropriate. It’s always something that can be discussed with our legislative branch, and with the people of Utah, but I think science should be taught in school, religion should be taught in the chapel or the synagogue.

JEFF ROBINSON, KCPW-FM 88.3: Governor, when it comes to sex education, there’s a proposal in the state legislature that would give public school students two tracks where the parents could decide A, that they will have comprehensive sex ed for their kids, or B, they will not. Do you support an option that would at least give parents the choice to give their kids comprehensive sex ed in public schools?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Another softball question, I appreciate that. Again, human biology is certainly something that is part of science, and we need to have an understanding as far as the human biology and how it works. And I think that’s appropriate. But I do believe that parents have a right to make decisions in behalf of their children. The kind of education that they receive, and how it’s being taught. When we get past just kind of the human biology aspects, into sex education, and lifestyle, that’s something best taught in the home, best taught by guardians, parents, religious advisors, those folks that that really is their charge. And again, I think parents, if they opt to take a special course, or have a special course and say we think this would be appropriate for our children, I have no problem with parents having choice. I’m a little reluctant about public education being an area where we teach, you know, some kind of lifestyle.

JEFF ROBINSON, KCPW-FM 88.3: But with the teen pregnancy rate, especially here in Salt Lake City and neighborhoods like Rose Park being very high, isn’t it important to make sure kids are getting this education, one way or another, especially the ones who aren’t getting it at home?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well I think it’s important they get the education. The question is who’s responsible to give it? You know, somehow we as parents seem to be giving up our responsibility of being parents and teaching our children. That is the parents’ responsibility on sex education. So we turn to government too often for too many things when we ought to be focusing on a few things that we’re really good at, which are only a few things. So, again, the responsibility lies with parents and guardians, not the schools.

ROD DECKER, KUTV-2: Salt Lake City, the Becker administration, is talking about a non-discrimination ordinance to specifically say one can’t discriminate against people on the basis of sexual preference in housing and employment. Some legislators are saying, if they do that, we will want to enact a state wide standard that may well be different from the Salt Lake standard. Would you support a state wide standard if Salt Lake City enacts a non-discrimination ordinance?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, I haven’t seen the ordinance, so I don’t know what the ramifications of that ordinance are, and I hate to speculate on what I would do without having a chance to read it, understand it, and see what the ramifications or the potential unintended consequences of that would be. I believe in local government. I believe that we ought to build ordinances and policies, ground-up. Bottom-up, not top-down. And most instances government closest to the people reflects the people’s will a lot better. So I would be patient and wait and see what comes up. The legislature will react as they typically do on these issues, but I’m not prepared to weigh in on that yet.

LISA RILEY ROCHE, DESERET NEWS: What would you have a problem with, Governor, in terms of an anti-discrimination ordinance based on sexual preference?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well I don’t think we should discriminate against people. I think people ought to be treated with respect. There’s nothing that causes me as an employer to say “well, I don’t want to hire you because—“ if you’re willing to follow the rules of my business and represent me in a fair and effective way. So I think we need to not discriminate against people when it comes to, you know, civil rights issues. I am reluctant for anybody to be put into a protected class. That seems to be where this road sometimes goes down, and that causes me some concern. But you know, we don’t have to have a rule for everybody to do the right thing. We ought to just do the right thing because it’s the right thing to do, and don’t have a law that punishes us if we don’t.

JEFF ROBINSON, KCPW 88.3: But then again, Governor, we already do for religion and race and ethnicity. So why not expand it? If you don’t believe anyone should be discriminated against. GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, where do you stop? I mean that’s the problem of going down that slippery road. Pretty soon we’re going to have a special offer blue-eyed blonds. And I’m not sure that that’s the case. Or people who are losing their hair a little bit, there’s a special classification that we put them in. JEFF ROBINSON, KCPW 88.3: I would support that. GOVERNOR HERBERT: See, there’s some support for about anything we put out there. And I’m just saying, you know, we end up getting bogged down sometimes with minutia of things the government has really no role to be involved with. ROBERT GEHRKE, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: So should sexuality, sexual orientation be a protected class? GOVERNOR HERBERT: No. ROBERT GEHRKE, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: If I could ask another tax question. The sales tax on food, is that something you would like to see restored? They repealed a portion of it. Is it something you’d like to see restored, if not this year, in future years? GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well tax policy is a complicated issue, and I know that Governor Huntsman and I worked a long time to try to get some tax reform in place, and that was certainly one of his issues was to take the sales tax off of food. As a local government guy, and my background, I was concerned about the removal of sales tax, and the impact it would have on the local government’s budget, particularly smaller rural cities where the grocery store is really the only commercial establishment they have. You know, I have no plans to change any of our tax policy that we currently have in place. Tax policy ought to be reviewed, particularly in the circumstances that we face ourselves with today. If the idea of having a lower rate and a broader base, then we have tax recommendations that say, you know, this sales tax removal of food doesn’t fit that category. I know it’s, in fact, counterproductive. But I have no plans to change that. I expect there’ll be all kinds of ideas as there always are in the legislature, that will be floated, tested, see whether there’s support. I have no plans to raise taxes.

ROBERT GEHRKE, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: Will you veto any budget that includes tax increases?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, again, that’s premature for me to say today. You know that’s six months away, really, to see what the circumstances are with our economy, what the needs are for the people of Utah, what the essential services are, how we’re going to be able to spread the dollars, how the rainy day fund will be able to plug the holes. You know, there’s a lot of “what ifs” and so it would be premature for me to say anything regarding vetoes.

ROBERT GEHRKE, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: But you’re not willing to guarantee no new taxes?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, I have no plans to put any, my proposals, to have any tax increases whatsoever. I actually believe, today, that we can have a balanced budget, providing the essential services that we, the people of Utah, want to have, at levels that we want to have, and are willing to pay for, without raising taxes.

ROBERT GEHRKE, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: You said earlier that you don’t believe sexual orientation should be a protected class. Can you explain your thinking a little bit on that, and why that differs from the other protected classes?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Again, that warrants a long, detailed explanation and discussion. I just think we go down a road that makes it difficult for employers to actually conduct their business with protected classes, where things that you don’t know when you hire people, and all of the sudden something changes, and all of the sudden they say, “well, you can’t fire me, because guess what.” And I think that presents a significant problem in our business community. That being said, again, I don’t think people should be discriminated against based on that. I just don’t think we need to have a law that ensures that.

REPORTER: Religion?

DAN BAMMES, KUER 90.1: The state of Utah has worked out an agreement, now, with the state of Nevada over the water resources in the Snake Valley, the underground aquifer there that lies underneath the state line. There are a number of people, especially those who live in the area, who feel the state of Utah is, first of all, giving away too much in that deal, and second, not really thinking through what the consequences might be for agriculture, rural lifestyle, and thinking mainly about urban water needs. What’s your view of that agreement, and whether or not the state of Utah to finally sign that?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, it’s a difficult issue. Water law is not as black and white as we would like to think. The determination of where the water is, who it belongs to, how much there is, and what we can do in transporting it to other areas, is a difficult issue. We live in a state that has been based on capturing water and transporting it to different places and making the desert “blossom as the rose” is the phrase we use here in Utah. So we understand that need to capture water and by ditch, pipe, canal, to take it to other areas. The debate over the water issue—and this is really a draft agreement, there is no agreement. This is a draft proposal, we’re in the process of getting public input. I’m interested in finding out what the public has to say about it, the local government officials that live out in the Snake Valley region, the Millard County commissioners, the farmers and ranchers out there, to get their input before I decide whether we should go and accept this agreement, or sign it, whether it should be modified, or whether we reject it altogether. Those are all on the table. We’ve got to start someplace. And again, one thing that we are going to commit ourselves to is that, as Governor of the state of Utah, we will fight for every drop of Utah water, we will not lose any water in this agreement that belongs to the state of Utah, and our residents. What Nevada does with their water is their issue. I have no jurisdiction there, whether they use it wisely or unwisely is their determination. But we’ll make sure we protect Utah’s water, which is part of our future.

MAX ROTH, FOX 13: I was talking with the Salt Lake Chamber yesterday, 80,000 Utahns don’t have jobs right now who would like to have jobs. You’re going to be up for election a year from November. As people are looking at your performance, how accountable will you be at that point for where that number is, or will you be?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well I’m accountable for everything now. You know, I’ve learned very quickly that the buck does stop with me. I cannot deflect it to anybody else. Whatever decisions we’re making in the executive branch are going to fall upon my shoulders. So I’m accountable, not only now, but at the end of 2010 and beyond if I’m fortunate enough to stay beyond. That being said, the economy in Utah is certainly not where we want it to be, but in comparison it’s a heck of a lot better than most states. We’re at 6 percent unemployment rate, which is 6 percent too high, but the national average is 9.4, so we’re about a third better than the rest of the country. Our emphasis needs to be on growing the economy. It is the number one focus that’s going to come out of my office. We will do everything we can to empower the private sector. We want to protect the jobs that are here so we don’t lose any more, and work with our local business community to see if they can’t, not only protect the jobs, but grow the jobs from within. We also have a significant effort in trying to attract businesses. And we have over 100 different entities right now, today, looking to Utah as a place to locate or expand their business operation. We have been discovered as a fertile field for business opportunity, and even in a downturned economy we’re facing today, we have opportunities and natural advantages to move ahead. So I’m going to be out and about with our private sector, with our business community, making sure that at least from the executive branch and for the state of Utah, we’re helping, not hindering their opportunities to survive, and in fact thrive in the economy.

MAX ROTH, FOX-13: Is it your goal in a year that we’ll be at 4 percent? 3 percent? Where will we be?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: My goal will be that we have full employment, in whatever number that manifests itself to be. 3 percent, most people, most economists think that’s full employment. There are always people in transition, you know, challenges that happen for a variety of reasons that people are unemployed for a period of time. We need to get back to the economy we had two, three years ago, that would be our goal, and we’ll be moving in that direction. And again, we want to have full employment.

JOHN DALY, KSL-5: Governor, there’s a pair of citizen initiatives that have come up, one about redistricting, another about ethics in the legislature, creating an independent ethics commission, and other ethics reforms. Are you inclined to support those? And would you sign those petitions if they came around and asked for your signature?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, I haven’t read the petitions to know what they say. Again, it’s like motherhood and apple pie. I’m for that too. You know just like I’m for fairness in our election process, and I’m for ethics. Who would not be? Again, we need to understand what the consequences will be. Again, I think election commissions and the redistricting commissions sometimes sound better than what they’re able to deliver. There’s no silver bullet. They are to make sure we have fairness in all aspects of redistricting. Somebody has to appoint somebody to the commission. You can jimmy the system by getting the right appointment there, just as much as by having the elected officials that maybe have a so-called vested interest there. So again, I’ll look at it very carefully. Again, I think moving towards ethic reform, and having higher ethics, raising the bar, making sure there’s fairness in the marketplace, those are all great goals and objectives that we all should subscribe to. So I support the effort.

JOHN DALY, KSL-5: Philosophically, are you inclined to think that we need more reform now or not? There are those who argue that, especially with the spectacular rise in money and politics over the last decade or more, that it’s needed. Are you inclined to just, generally speaking, support, or think that reforms like that are needed?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: There’s probably a lot of reform that are necessary, a lot of areas that we can improve upon. Just having more civility in the debate would be a step in the right direction. And I wish we had more civility. We seem to be so partisan sometimes, particularly on a national level, on issues that are so emotional that rational thought goes out the window. We can’t get together and reason. When I talk about unprecedented partnerships, I mean we’ve got to get together on all sides of the issue, left and/or right, and see if we can’t find solutions. If we continue to fight, pull against each other, we won’t get anything done that’s positive for the people of Utah. So again, I think we need to raise the bar, we need to be open, we need to be transparent, we need to do things where the public can have trust in their elected officials. If for some reason they’re cynical, we need to do something to change that. It may be just a misunderstanding, poor communication, lack of leadership. There’s a lot of things that we can do to improve our relationship with the public and have the public say, “You know what? Those guys are working pretty hard and pretty good. We disagree sometimes, but they’re ethical, good-quality, professional elected officials.”

DAN BAMMES, KUER FM90: Governor, many members of your party feel uncomfortable with the initiative process. Utah has had its initiative process upheld by the state Supreme Court time and again, but some people are worried that it might become more like California, where there’s a ballot initiative on twelve things in every election. What’s your comfort level with the initiative process and the way it works in Utah?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, California is a perfect example of initiative process gone awry. You have conflicting initiatives that creates conflicting statutes and laws. There are areas where they’ve not able to be debated. You don’t find out what are some of the unintended consequences. That’s why you have a legislative process, with committees, we have opportunity to hear the pros and cons, debate it, vet it, and then come up with legislation that needs to be tweaked, modified, and eventually have something that will work. As opposed to initiative petition process that what you vote on is what you get. Good, bad, or ugly, with all the warts, and many times unintended consequences that were not able to be discovered in the initiative process. So again, I have a jaundiced eye about the results that come with initiatives, but I believe it’s important for the people to have that process, to have the checks and balances that are necessary on the legislative process is kind of the 2 X 4 to kind of hit us up the side of the head to, if nothing else, get our attention.

DAN BAMMES, KUER FM90: For instance, school vouchers? That was a citizen initiative that influenced it.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: School vouchers are over, the public has spoken. We need to move on beyond that. That won’t be resurrected for, you know, a decade or more. But I think education excellence, which we can all embrace, are something that we need to work together on. And again, I expect, as your 17th Governor, to lead the charge on education excellence moving forward. CHRIS VANOCUR, ABC-4: Governor, have you seen the documentary “An Inconvenient Truth”? And what do you think of it, if you’ve seen it?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I have seen it, and it’s inconvenient. And there are some inconvenient mistruths, I think in that, that we’re finding with new science, that there’s additional point of view. Again, I’ve said I’m not taking a position on man-caused global warming, the impact we have. I think science needs to have that continued discussion and debate. Clearly, as we see in the marketplace, the debate is not over. There may be some that say it is, but it looks like to me there’s still a healthy debate. Frankly, going into the end of the year, I’d like to encourage that debate and bring together people on all sides of this issue and say, “Let’s have at it. Let’s have a discussion, and let’s let the people decide.”

DAN BAMMES, KUER FM90: All right, thank you very much, Governor, for being with us today. I’m sure people will be interested in looking at your remarks on line at UEN.org, and we’ll look forward to meeting with you again next month.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I’m looking forward to it too.

DAN BAMMES, KUER FM90: Thank you very much.

Return to home page