July 2, 2019

"We talked about the importance of serving mankind, not based on their religion or their non-religion, but their humanity and seeing what can we all do as our responsibilities to lift people up, and to help them have a better circumstance in life." Governor Herbert

ANNOUNCER: KUED presents the Governor's Monthly News Conference, an exchange between Utah reporters and Governor Gary Herbert.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Good morning. 

REPORTERS: Good morning, Governor. 

GOVERNOR HERBERT: As you know, I just returned from a trade mission to Europe, and had an opportunity to go over there with 23 different companies from Utah, and had over 50 meetings in a very compact period of time. I can tell you we had a great opportunity to see some wonderful sites, meet wonderful people, but there's no place like home. It's great to be back.

Again, we have wonderful scenery here and wonderful people, and I hope we appreciate the successes that Utah's having compared to other parts of the world, and even other parts of our country. The fact that our economy is very healthy. Most diverse healthy economy in the world, 2.9% unemployment rate, job opportunities, GDP growth, on average 3.5%, some areas 5% to 6%. Personal income is up, leading the nation. Again, I hope we appreciate the great quality of life we have here, I know having gone out of the country, and then coming back, I'm reminded of the blessing of being here in Utah, and living in this great country.

That being said, again with our opportunities with trade missions to improve relationships, to meet with people, to have mutual exchange, particularly for economic opportunity is not insignificant. We were able to reinforce relationships, for example, with Stadler Rail, who's now made in Salt Lake City, their national headquarters of North America. Again, they're going to now expand even more than we thought as far as creating more job opportunities here in Utah 

We had the opportunity to go to the Paris Air Show. As you know, one of our sectors growing dramatically is aerospace. I mean with the leaders of so many different companies there, and clearly, Utah is on their radar screen as a place they would like to be at or expand into opportunities for us to manufacture, whether it be composite materials, or Boeing expanding their footprint here for parts of the Boeing airlines, Northrop Grumman, they're just a, goes on and on and on. I do believe that with what we've met, whether it be aerospace, life sciences, agri-business, which were all represented on this trade mission, we will create, over the next few years, 4,000 to 8,000 new jobs here in the state of Utah. Career opportunities for people. So these trade missions are important on many different levels.

Maybe the highlight for me was a little nontraditional in that we had an opportunity to meet with His Holiness, Pope Francis. That was an important occasion, and really an opportunity for me. To me, the fellow's probably the most recognized personality in the world. 1.2 billion Catholics in the world and certainly he's recognized for his compassionate service, and his care for the underprivileged.

Had an opportunity to meet with Pietro Parolin, who's the Cardinal and is the number two in command. Had an extended opportunity to talk to him for about an hour.

We talked about the importance of serving mankind, not based on their religion or their non-religion, but their humanity and seeing what can we all do as our responsibilities to lift people up, and to help them have a better circumstance in life. Interesting conversation we had and I whole-heartily agree with the Cardinal on that effort.

And last but not least, again the opportunity meeting with the Pope. His last comment to me was a little bit surprising. He said to me and to Jeanette, the first lady, "Would you pray for me?" And, people come from all over the world to the Vatican, asking for the Pope's blessing on them, and for him to say to Jeanette and I, "Would you pray for me," was a lesson to be learned. 

Again, I think it's important that we all consider praying for those, even though we have a difference of opinion on philosophy and politics, or I come from a different faith than the Pope comes from, but the idea that we ought to pray for each other's success, and help us to do better for mankind, is an important aspect of this trip. I want you to know I've added to my prayers, Pope Francis and his leadership team for the Catholic church and others.

Again, we're in a time when we see a lot of differences and contention and conflict, when we ought to be cheering for the success of those that are on the same team, even though maybe we have different roles, and different positions we play. So that's probably going to be my most memorable thing for this trade mission. Maybe the best souvenir I'm going to take back from Europe is the comments from the pope and the Catholic church to me and Jeanette. So with that, what questions would you have for me today?

ERIK NEILSEN, KUED: Well Governor, the first debate for Salt Lake City mayor happened last night and I'm wondering what your impressions were of the debate, specifically about air quality, and working with the state legislature? 

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well on air quality, certainly something the state's taking very seriously. It's a common issue. Again, we have inversions here and that compounds whatever pollution we have. We've put in the budget this past year, with the help of the legislature a little less than what I wanted, but we still have $28 million going into, in fact air quality issues. That's a lot of money, it's a good down-payment. And the success we've had in reducing the pollution ought to be recognized. Doesn't mean we're where we want to be, but at least applaud the effort and the fact that we're trending in the right direction.

So air quality, for a lot of reasons, certainly ought to be top of mind for everybody, all elected officials including those running for mayor of Salt Lake City. Very important issue for me is this idea that I hear expressed of better collaboration and cooperation from Salt Lake City, our capital city, with in fact the state of Utah. And I think that's really significantly important. We have not seen that a lot in the past, we need to see that more in the future.

And so I hope that whoever's elected to be the mayor of Salt Lake City in this next go-around, understands they need to work with the governor, with the legislature. There's more than we have in common than we have differences. And again, as evidence of that, keep in mind when we pass legislation at the state level, republicans and democrats working together on issues, 95% of those pieces of legislation this past session were passed virtually unanimously. We can come together, we ought to come together, and we should come together. I'm looking forward to have better cooperation with the future mayor of Salt Lake City. 

BEN WINSLOW, FOX-13: Is there anyone particularly you're favoring right now?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Not really, I'm not going to step out and say there's some good choices out there that I like. I think Aaron Mendenhall did a really good job as the chairman of the council and stepping forward when we had problems at the inland port, and bringing the council along. Luz Escamilla, again a very good legislature who certainly understands the issues there in her district, in Rose Park and as part of the legislature, I think has the ability, in fact, to bring people together. David Ibarra, again a businessperson of somebody that I think understands the free market system. That's an important aspect of think, of leadership, understanding how the system works, and how it can work better. So those are three.

I hope we have somebody, again, that has good values, good principles and is willing to cooperate and collaborate with the state. That's what I'm looking for. 

BEN WINSLOW, FOX-13: Governor, I wanted to ask what that status is of negotiations with the legislature over the ban on conversion therapy on LGBTQ children? As you know, the Salt Lake County Council recently passed a resolution calling for the legislature to pass the ban. So what's happening with that? You've been involved in the talks.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well thank you. I anticipated that question today, Ben, and thank you for asking about it. It certainly an issue that has some significant emotion to it, probably on all sides of the issue, by the way. Parental rights, what do we have as correct therapy? What should be appropriate, what should not be appropriate? And how do we resolve some of those differences in conflicts? 

So to that and starting here a number of weeks ago, and working with the legislature, and with others involved in this issue, I've sent a letter to our Department of Commerce, Francine Giani. Let me just read to you if I could here what the first paragraph of a letter is. I can make copies of this available to anybody who'd like to have one, but.

Dear Francine, I'm directing you today in your capacity as overseeing the Division of Occupational and Professional Licensing to have the Psychologist Licensing Board provide additional guidance for the development of rules on the ethics, ethical and professional practice of psychology in Utah. This needs to be done in an area that should be governed by the best available science, rather than left to unregulated or regulated in a matter that is colored by politics.

Specifically, I want the state to ethically regulate psychological interventions for minor children regarding their sexual orientation, and gender identity. I like those proposed rules to be available for public comment no later than September 16th of 2019. 

So we're going to turn this to the licensing people. They'll use the best available science. They'll have the opportunity to see what works, and what doesn't work, what should be done, what shouldn't be done. The public will have the opportunity to weigh-in on that issue. It will save us time, it will take it out of the political arena. That's not mean it forecloses on future legislation, but we don't need to wait 'til 2020 to deal with this. This will help us get a leg up, and probably get some better insight. I think all parties in this issue will I think applaud, should applaud this effort to direct it to the professional licensing.

BEN WINSLOW, FOX-13: So this is a directive from your office to the, to one of your agencies to regulate conversion therapy, if I understand you correctly? 

GOVERNOR HERBERT: That's right, they have the right to say rules and regulations on licensing and professionals anyway. What are the rules for beauticians? What are the rules for plumbing? What are the rules for this or that? We're going to have, there's a number of boards involved in this and again, the complete letter you can see, but particularly I'm wanting to have the Psychologist Licensing Board provide guidance, rules and regulations. What are the parameters, what can you do, what can you not do based on good science, and public input. And they'll come up with some rules. I want that available by September 16th of this year.

BEN WINSLOW, FOX-13: So what do you want it to say? No conversion therapy, conversion therapy's okay? Conversion therapy's okay so long as it's not abusive? What do you want it to say?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I certainly have some concerns about some of the abuse that I've heard talked about, but I'm not a psychologist, this is not my background. I'm going to rely upon the experts to tell us what should be done or not be done, or how it should be done. Again, I'm not putting any limitations on what will be discovered and what will come out of this review in this analysis. 

But I expect we'll have some recommendations available for the public to make comment on on September 16th of this year. That'll put us in line to say do we need additional legislation? Do we in fact, as the license and the rules and regulations that come out of our Department of Professional Licensing adequate enough, we don't need anything more? I don't know. I'm not going to say this is what we should have or not have. That's not my expertise, but these folks have the expertise, will have the ability to get expertise to give us guidance.

BEN WINSLOW, FOX-13: But this, proponents of this have said that so long as it's not abusive, opponents have said that all of this is abusive. Where do you stand as the man who's issuing the directive?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I don't know that everything is being done is abusive. Again, that's not my expertise, that's like asking me to come and fix the plumbing in your, how would you like to fix the plumbing in your house? I'm saying that's not my job, that's not what I'm qualified to do, but I know we can hire plumbers that are qualified, and architects and those that need to tell us how to put the plumbing in your house. So I'm looking to the experts to in fact have this discussion with other experts and give us some rules and regulations which we can take a look at as a public, and hopefully give us the parameters necessary to bring us together on this issue, and say this is the right approach for Utah to take when it comes to conversion therapy. But it's, that's quite a large gamut, whether it's sexual orientation, same-sex attraction, gender identity, all those things. And they're not all necessary the same.

ERIK NEILSEN, KUED: Are you expecting some sort of enforcements policy to come out of this too?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I don't know. We'll see what the recommendations are.

BEN WINSLOW, FOX-13: And by doing this, you're bypassing the legislature. How do you think that's going to go over? 

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I've already vented with the legislature. They like what we're doing. I think this is a good approach to take. It doesn't mean there won't be future legislation, but this brings the science together and the people are involved in this kind of therapy. It allows parents to in fact weigh-in, and talk about what their concerns are.

We have differences of opinion. Again, this is where we kind of bump up against parental rights. What is my right to raise my children, and give them the therapy I think they need, or the treatments I think are important versus what the science tells us, if that's an opposing point of view? I don't know, I hope they reconcile. But this'll give us an opportunity, and we don't have to wait 'til next January to start this conversation. I'm starting it now. This'll be, I think a good process for us to follow, and that might lead to new legislation. We'll have to wait and see.

BEN WINSLOW, FOX-13: Any concerns about a legal challenge? If somebody doesn't like the way the rules go?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: You know, seems like litigation's a part of society, unfortunately all too often. So I wouldn't want to pre-suppose that we won't have litigation, but I don't know why we would. Again, this is a good process. We're bringing experts together, and seeing what the process develops. We're just following kind of the rules we already have on the books. 

AMY JOI O’DONOGHUE, DESERET NEWS: Governor, what do you think of the Supreme Court decision today that came down on gerrymandering?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well I haven't had a chance really to review it other than I've heard that the comments really are that this is not a federal issue that's been presented. This is a state issue, and that's probably where a lot of us thought it was anyway. And so, the legislature does have the right to create rules on how we in fact redistrict. The public has spoken on a very narrow margin, but I expect that we will in fact follow that as a blueprint and kind of how we will in fact direct the legislature to in fact redistrict at the appropriate time. I don't know that it impacts us all that much, it just helps maybe some clarification this is a state issue.

BENJAMIN WOOD, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: Governor, do you personally think there needs to be rules around how the boundaries are drawn for partisan interest?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I think guidelines and, they're important, helps the legislature as they try to decide how to draw the lines. Those who are involved in elections are concerned about we gerrymander and so it makes it difficult for one party or the other party. And it probably has worked both ways in the state of Utah. There's some areas that seem to be democrat strongholds, some of the republican strongholds. How do you carve up the state to make it fair for everybody and get the appropriate representation? Not necessarily an easy thing to do. But I do know the last time we did it that democrats and republicans unanimously agreed to the legislative's redistricting.

The only controversy seems to be whether we've got the congressional seats redistrict correctly. Whether you have a pinwheel design or carve it up a different way, that'll probably be part of the discussion in the debate as we go forward. I'm anxious to see what the legislature comes up with.

BENJAMIN WOOD, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: But in. 

MICHAEL ORTON, CAPITAL PRESS CORPS: Governor, there was a popular topic of infrastructure, both at the national and local level. Some of our press corps are still assembling data on water treatment issues in the state, relative to, nutrient pollution and toxic algae blooms. But one thing that came up just recently at a conference was un-reinforced masonry and buildings in the state that are really in bad shape regarding a vulnerability for earthquake damage. They said, and this is a quote, " A 6.5 category earthquake will destroy Utah's economy, "mostly due to the fact that we do, "we have weak zoning and ordinances, "weak building codes and have done little "in the past 40 years to demolish "or retrofit unsafe buildings." What do you think is necessary?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Who said that, Mike?

MICHAEL ORTON, CAPITAL PRESS CORPS: Pardon?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Who said that?

MICHAEL ORTON, CAPITAL PRESS CORPS: Somebody in the Fix the Bricks program here, part of the state monitoring here, one of the authorities there.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well you've done it again. You've found something that I am not all that familiar with as far as the report or the study, or the recommendation. Clearly, I know that when it comes to our infrastructure needs, whether that be access to water and make sure that our water's potable and usable. That's a big issue for me, and something' we're doing significant efforts on as far as making sure we have water to accommodate the growth of Utah for the next 50 years. And infrastructure needs, whether that's roads, highways, byways, mass transit, how we deliver water and our canals.

I know we spend a lot of money at the Capital to in fact not only go back and refurbish the Capital, but also to earthquake-proof it for up to a 7.0 earthquake. Others are doing that in the private sector. It's hard to go back and say to somebody if you've already build a building, by the way, a city or county saying you've got to now retrofit or go back and spend millions of dollars on your building.

If you build a new one though that's not as hard for them to say if you're going to build a new structure here, here's some additional things you've got to do, as we are smarter now when it comes to earthquakes then we were 20 or 30 years ago. So it's a combination of probably all those things working together to make sure that we are safe and sound as we can possibly be.

MICHAEL ORTON, CAPITAL PRESS CORPS: One of the recommendations coming out of that conference apparently was that there'd be a 10 year period of time for multi-unit buildings that are soft ones that are vulnerable. By the way, a 6.5 earthquake is far less than what I've personally experienced twice in California. But they're saying 10 years, give the building owners 10 years to either demo or retrofit, and then start fining them, in terms of public safety, primarily.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Yeah, again if there's a recommendation out there, ought to be considered in the legislature. The zoning is mostly involved with cities, so we ought to work with the league of cities in town, as well as the Utah Association of Counties. It really falls under their purview, whether they want to change or modify or enforce new zoning laws. So again, that maybe bubble up and may be something for the upcoming legislative session.

BEN WINSLOW, FOX-13: Governor back on the issue of the Supreme Court's ruling on partisan gerrymandering, do you plan to ask the legislature to consider or accept the recommendations that this independent commission, set up by, that voters approved under Prop 4 or is it back to the proverbial drawing board? Just accept what the legislature does 

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I think they're going to listen to the will of the people, and again although it passed by, what about 1%, I think some recommendations in that are probably very appropriate to be considered as they in fact redistrict. I don't think it's a matter of me encourage them. I think they'll do that just as a matter of course. I think that's important. I think we want to have people feel like that how we redistrict has some fairness to it, that it's really not just a political decision, but it's really designed to in fact help the people have fair and adequate representation. Whatever the office is that they are voting upon. I think the legislature will do the right thing in the right way.

BEN WINSLOW, FOX-13: Any opinion on the census question being blocked for now by the US Supreme Court? That's a big issue that goes into redistrict.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Yeah, I've been told it passed unanimously. But it also had some issues that were divisive, and so they've not all agreed on some of the subheadings of that issue. I know we don't want to impugn anybody's civil rights, and we're very sensitive to the question whether you're a citizen or not. Although knowing who are citizens and who are not in our society probably helps us as far as developing policy. So it's probably a piece of information that probably helpful.

The question goes beyond that as whether you're legal, or undocumented and so, that gets to be a little bit more emotional. Of course as you know, Utah's been very friendly, and should be to refugees and to immigration folks. We have a significant belief in compassion, and humanity of people and want to keep families together, and all those thing which I think are important values that's represent Utah.

BENJAMIN WOOD, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: Governor, there's been talk of a special session to appropriate funding for the census. Do you think that's necessary or is the state ready?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well I don't know where the budget line item is there. If we're inadequate, well that will be corrected in the upcoming legislative session, but we've anticipated. I think some money's been set aside, whether it's adequate or not. As we get closer to the census, next year, we'll probably have an opportunity to beef up that fund and make sure that we have adequate funds to do an appropriate census evaluation in Utah.

BEN WINSLOW, FOX-13: Governor, there's potentially a ballot initiative this, in 2020 that would put, impose a carbon tax to help with air quality and to provide rural Utah economic stimulus. Do you have a position on that yet?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: You know, I've, I don't really have a hard position. I'm not opposed to looking at a carbon tax. The intent is to pay for the cost of carbon, and what it does to our air quality. I think everybody supports having cleaner air. The, we certainly want to have potable water. So these environmental concerns are important. We are actually making change of securing without the carbon tax. So the question is do you need it? Will it accelerate change to greener power or not? I'm not certain. 

Again, we just announced at our Energy Summit some significant opportunities for greener fuel, whether that be geothermal, combination with hydro. We have wind power, solar. We are the largest user of wind power Intermountain West, as a state. We're exploring a lot of solar power now to California, geothermal to California and opportunities to come together. Again, it's happening. We know that the public wants to have sustainable, reliable energy. They want to have it affordable, and they want to have it cleaner. That clearly is happening. Right now, for example, we reduced our reliance on coal from 85% of our energy portfolio to 65%. That's a significant reduction.

We've increased our greener fuels from 1% to 11%. That's a significant increase. So the market itself is shaping what's happening for energy production, and Utah's at the forefront on all of the above approach in a free market system.

BEN WINSLOW, FOX-13: So you're not opposed to a carbon tax. How does that factor into any discussions with tax reform? Even should this pass, are you suggesting that maybe the legislature look at that?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I am suggesting we ought to consider all things. I'm saying I'm not sure that the carbon tax will change the outcome. But it's certainly worth a discussion. I'm not supporting it, I'm not opposed to it. I'm willing to have the discussion.

MICHAEL ORTON, CAPITAL PRESS CORPS: One thing that we know about, Governor, that you have really championed over five years or more that I am aware of is trying to get Utahans covered with their healthcare. Attorney General Barr is trying to get the court to strike down the law that makes it so that pre-existing conditions are not a problem for people and there are many that are normal and out there. How does Utah weigh-in on this, and given the fact that you have really worked hard on this issue?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well there's a lot of opinions out there. Anybody can issue an opinion, and William Barr is no exception That being said, we're trying to in fact do kind of our approach on healthcare. We're waiting for our waivers to come in, we've got the first part done. I think the Department of Health is very supportive of what we're doing. I think the White House is supportive. I still hope we'll have our waivers by the end of this summer so that we can move ahead, and make sure that our experience here in Utah has accessed a good quality healthcare at affordable prices. We're leading the nation, frankly, when it comes to quality of healthcare at lower cost.

ERIK NEILSEN, KUED: Well Governor, thank you very much. We're out of time. We won't see you in July, we'll see you in August.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Looking forward to it. I can, I'm starting to count the days already. 

REPORTERS: Thank you, Governor.

REPORTERS: Thank you, Governor.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Thank you.

ANNOUNCER: This has been the Governor's Monthly News Conference. An archive of transcripts, video and audio is available online. Please visit KUED.org. Thanks for joining us.

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