November 20, 2015

"We need to put money into education so that we can continue to recruit good quality teachers and retain good quality teachers" Governor Herbert

 

Announcer: KUED presents “The Governor’s Monthly News Conference,” an exchange between Utah reporters and Governor Gary Herbert. This program was recorded earlier.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Good morning. Thank you for being here.  And before we take questions, let me just remind you, as you probably already know, we’re getting ready for the upcoming legislative session. And this December, next month, I’ll roll out my budget recommendations. And we’ve been working on the budget for a couple of months.  I think we’ll have a good recommendation for the legislature.

As you also know, my budget priorities have been education.  And I’m pleased to know, with the help of the legislature that they’ve embraced the idea that we need to make sure that we fund education appropriately, as we’re able to in this state.  And by doing that, we’ve increased our education funding over the last 4 years $1.326 billion. Not an insignificant number.  A lot of new money into education.And we need to do that. 

Clearly, we understand the need to have educational achievement in our state to increase, to raise the bar when it comes to educational achievement.  And in so doing, we’ll be able to continue to have prosperity when it comes to our economy.  And I’m just pleased to say to you that it’s working.  For example, last year we put an additional $512 million into the educational budget with the help of the legislature.

And what that means to us now is that we are, in fact, having above average scores now.  We were 51 when it comes to pupil spending, but—and when it comes to fourth grade in math, reading, and science, we’re now above average when it comes to those achievements. And when we get into 8th grade, which is really encouraging, we’re now in the top 10 when it comes to reading and science, and 16th in math.So we’re getting a good return.  But we need to put money into education so that we can continue to recruit good quality teachers and retain good quality teachers.

The other good news is that our graduation rates have increased by 8 percent over the last 5 years.  We now are at 83 percent, which is 2 percent above the national average.  And what’s also is encouraging is that we have significant increase in graduation rates with our minorities and our students with disabilities.  So we’re also getting good results there where people are concerned, and we’re coming together here for better outcomes.

Another encouraging note is that our administrative costs, we’ve been able to lower our administrative costs so that we are now the second lowest in the nation when it comes to the cost of administration. The national average is $212 per student. Here in Utah, we’re at $72 per student. And it’s probably worth noting that the US Chamber of Commerce in fact calls Utah’s education system, “The best return on an investment of any state in the nation.” So there’s a lot of good news in what we’re doing with education.  There’s a lot of good outcomes.  We need to continue to put money and increasing amounts of money, again, to continue this trend.  We want to be the best educational system in America, certainly a top ten in every category.

And we need to make sure that we continue to recruit the best and brightest in the classroom, and retain them to stay in the classroom if we’re continue to have this kind of achievement.  So, again, I’m looking forward to the December roll out of our budget. I think you’ll find, again, that education will be my number one budget priority.

ROD DECKER, KUTV-2: Last year, in your budget, you helped education. In your budget, and then at the end of it too. One of the things you suggested is the end of the 30 percent new sales tax growth earmark. But I believe, if I recall correctly, you weren’t successful in that. You had some success, but not in that. Will you be beating on them again, and saying, “Take the earmark for roads off sales tax.” 

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, as you know, the longest journey starts with the first step.  And maybe that was the first step last year, of bringing to everybody’s attention that we’re earmarking maybe too much of our general fund money. And really, it’s 43 percent of all the new growth in general fund now is been earmarked and taken off the table.

It may be that we’re spending it appropriately, but it ought to be competing with all of the other demands that we have in the marketplace out there so that the legislature has to give consideration to the different ideas and issues out there and then make a decision, as opposed to taking that money off the table.

And I do recognize that the legislative task force here just a couple of weeks ago recognized this same issue and have said, “We need to take a look at maybe having too many earmarks when it comes to our general fund money.  So I expect that we’ll continue to have that discussion.  And I expect we’ll in fact pull back on the amount of monies that are earmarked.

ROD DECKER, KUTV-2: You were very circumspect last year, but you indicated if the legislature wanted to raise taxes for education, you might not be adverse. I would be willing to say you advocated a tax increase.  Are you going to do that again? 

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I’m not advocating any tax increase.  There’s three ways to pay for education. One is in fact to reprioritize.  So you take from one bucket of money and put it into education.  And take it from transportation, take it from health and human services, put it into education.  So that’s one way, is you prioritize a finite bag of money.

The other one is to raise taxes.  I know there’s some inclination and desire to raise taxes.  And in doing so, you create more revenue. At least, that’s the theory.  Now, we’ve seen that theory has gone awry in many places in the country today in coming out of the great recession. Illinois, for example, raised taxes and immediately lost 100,000 jobs over the next 6 months, bringing in less money than they thought they would get with the tax raise.

We’ve chosen, in Utah, to really grow the economy. The expanding, rising, growing economy produces more revenue without having to put undue burden on the individuals, onto the companies, and different entities out there that pay tax.  And that’s why our economy, at least one of the reasons our economy’s continuing to grow and expand. So I’m one who believes let’s expand the economy. That produces more money.  The rising tide that raises all boats on the pond is the growing, expanding economy.  And we’re the best in America today, so it’s clearly working. 

BOB BERNICK, UTAHPOLICY.COM: Governor, you just had a poll today, I think, that says 2/3 of Utahans would be willing to raise their income tax by 1 percentage point from 5 percent to 6 percent if it was targeted for education and went down to the school level. So I got to ask you, if 2/3 of Utahans want to raise taxes, why the heck don’t you do it?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, we won’t do it because we don’t want to kill the goose that’s laying the golden eggs, and that’s the growing economy.  We are competitive economically because we, in fact, have a competitive tax rate.

We’re at the lower ten states in America when it comes to tax liability. We have a very balanced approach, by the way. We have competitive income tax rates. We have lower than the national average when it comes to property tax. We have competitive sales tax rates. And so that three-legged stool is working very well.

It’s a matter of having kind of the optimal for the economic engine. The right amount of oxygen, the right amount of petroleum, making sure our spark plugs are working. And right now, in Utah, we are the best performing economy.  So there’s no reason to tamper with the engine that’s running so smoothly and so good right now. So I don’t think it’s time for any kind of a tax increase. 

BEN WINSLOW, FOX-13: Governor, recently the LDS church changed its policy on same-sex couples, married same-sex couples, as well as same-sex couples with children. It’s certainly been a flashpoint of debate and contention. Your feelings on it, both as Governor and a practicing Mormon.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, let me speak as the Governor, because that’s why I’m here. And far be it for me to tell any religion, whether it’s the LDS church, the Catholic church, Protestants, non-Christian, what their doctrine should be, what their policies and practices should be.

I do harken back to the government operation of this past legislative session, with Senate Bill 296, where we worked together on all sides of this issue to come together with a bill that protected LGBT rights, and also protected the religious ideas and practices of the religious side of this equation.  That’s what we need to talk about, how we can bring people together. We’re not going to be involved in government in telling religions what to do and how to do it. 

BRIAN GRIMMETT, KUER: From a government role, then what do you make of a judge’s recent decision to remove a child from a lesbian couple who wasn’t—they were—they’re foster parents.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: You know, I’m a little puzzled about the action down there, personally.  But here’s what I expect to happen; our Division of Child and Family Services, DCFS, their number one responsibility is to protect the safety and welfare of the child.  Putting them into foster care, I know that’s been vetted, and I expect that’s what they will continue to do and make sure that the child’s welfare is number one issue for them to follow.

The other side is I expect the court and the judge to follow the law. He may not like the law, but he should follow the law.  We don’t want to have activism on the bench in any way, shape, or form. And again, laws sometimes people don’t like, but the judge should not interject his own personal beliefs and feelings, superseding the law. So I expect this’ll be under review. And again, I expect DCFS to continue to worry about the welfare of the child. I expect the courts and the judge to follow the law. 

BRIAN GRIMMETT, KUER: Right now, there’s no legal method to select state school board members. How would you like to see that fixed, and when would you like to see that fixed?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, we’ve had an opportunity this past legislative session to in fact address that issue. And with Judge Waddoups’ ruling kind of throwing things kind of into a little bit of chaos there as far as the system we’ve had on the books before, we have not been able to, in the legislature, come together on some kind of a compromise.  Some want partisan. Some want non-partisan.  Some want the governor more involved in the selection process. And all three of those ideas have merit, by the way. 

I expect that because we didn’t come up with a solution this past session, we will come up with a solution in the upcoming session of 2016. Right now, all of those who want to throw their hat in the ring will be put on the ballot in November.

I personally wished we could go to a ballot and have a primary to kind of winnow the field down, to make it a little more understandable for the electorate out there to pick and choose who they want to represent them on the school board. And if there’s any adjustment that could be made, that would be one that I would support. 

BEN WINSLOW, FOX-13: Governor, on the issue of Senate Bill 54, and there seems to be some disagreement over how you interpret the signature gathering, how do you interpret it? The Republican Party says one thing, the Lieutenant Governor’s office says another. What do you think?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, there are differences of opinion out there on this issue. That’s clearly the situation today, and I think we need to in fact, speaking on behalf of the Republican Party, and we need to come together on it, and rather than, you know, divide each other because we have differences of opinion.  But I do believe, and I support this idea that let’s go to court, and have the courts make the definitive declaration so that we understand with clarity what the process is going forward. 

I trust the Lieutenant Governor’s office to be accurate. I know they’re getting counsel from the Attorney General’s office on the legalese and what the position that we’ve had under Senate Bill 54. I understand some of the concerns that members of the State Central Party, particularly, and the Republican Party have that’s a little different point of view.  How do we resolve that?  I think the best way is to go to courts and have the court resolve that issue, and give us definitively what it means.  Then candidates will know what the process is going forward. 

BOB BERNICK, UTAHPOLICY.COM: But do you think this State Party should kick somebody out of the Republican Party if they go the petition route?  You’ve told me previously that you were planning on doing both routes. You were going to do the petition and do the convention.  Under the way it stands now, James Evans says he would kick you out of the Republican Party. 

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, that’s today. Let’s see what happens tomorrow.  Again, I think we will find a declaration from the courts so we’ll know, whatever our opinions are, that we may differ. I’m a Republican. I’ve always been a Republican. I won office as a Republican.  I’m the governor, Republican, a big “R” is by my name.  I’m going to run for re-election as a Republican. I expect that whatever we need to do to reconcile differences within the party will happen before the March finding deadline.

LISA RILEY ROCHE, DESERET NEWS:  Riley Roche: Are you still going to go the petition route as well as the caucus convention route, Governor?  I know you’ve had some mixed feelings about that lately. 

GOVERNOR HERBERT: You know, I’m very comfortable going before the convention, and with the caucus system. Again, I’ve told you before that I am a product of the caucus convention system. Again, a person of average means, not having a lot of personal wealth, and it’s allowed me to compete with those who are better known and have larger budgets. So I’ve appreciated the caucus convention system.

It works best when everybody shows up and participates.  And we don’t have extreme voices on either the left or the right that sometimes are the more zealot like. That being said, I’ll wait and see what the rules are and participate as I think’s in the best interest of my re-election efforts. But I am very comfortable going to the caucus convention system, and figure that I can certainly come out of that.

LISA RILEY ROCHE, DESERET NEWS:  What would be your advice for other Republican candidates at this point, given that it’s a pretty short window to expect a ruling from the court?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Yes, again, I think there’s some urgency there. And hopefully, the court would understand that urgency, because we do have elections coming up next year, and so it would be nice to have a declaration and clarity of this issue right away. And I think all of us need to work together. It’s not a matter of us pulling apart and arguing back and forth.

Let’s just decide what it is.  The legislature, with Senate Bill 54, did what they did because they wanted to protect the caucus convention system.  There was worry that, because of the going to just a straight general election, that the public was gonna support that, by polling and by analysis.  So they did that, I think, with good intentions. And it’s caused a lot more controversy and strife than probably anybody ever thought, at least, certainly on the Republican Party side.  So let’s resolve it and move forward. We’re wasting too much time and energy on this issue. And we need to be governing.  We need to be electing Republicans to office.  I think it’s given us great outcomes here in Utah.  I mean, I, look, proof is in the pudding. We clearly have been a mostly Republican state.

Democrats have a role to play.  There’s certainly the loyal opposition, and they’re welcome as a part of the fabric of Utah.  But the Republican leadership has given us really good outcomes when we look at the economy, the achievement as education I just talked about.  All areas that you can measure, we’re doing pretty well as a state because of Republican leadership.

LISA RILEY ROCHE, DESERET NEWS: Another option would be the Republican Party just to go along with the judge’s ruling as interpreted by a lot of other people, saying, “Just go forward now.”

GOVERNOR HERBERT: It’s probably not part of the DNA of Republicans to just go along.  You know, it is some leadership responsibility. You believe in a cause, you believe in principles, and that’s embodied in our party platform. So I don’t think we’re just gonna go along. But we ought to find a way and a process to resolve it so we can come together and continue to govern and elect Republicans.  I speak that as a partisan Republican Governor.

That being said, again, we have great Democrats, we have great Independents, and others in our state that are part of our overall fabric of Utah.  And all are welcome. And all are necessary. The loyal opposition is just, in fact, that; the loyal opposition. And it helps us create appropriate balance in our state.

ROBERT GEHRKE, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE:  Gerhke: So do you plan to call a special session, either on this school board issue or on the SB 54 issue? 

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I have no plans to call a special session.  You know, I am certainly willing to have discussions with legislative leadership on this issue and other issues that maybe have a timeliness to it.  But as of right now, I have no plans to call a special session. The regular session is just a couple of months away.  So there’s gonna have to be some sense of urgency or need that would compel me.

MICHAEL ORTON, UTAHPOLITICALCAPITOL.COM: Governor, on the topic of cooperation and working together with the noble opposition, the Clinton campaign released a white paper regarding coal communities in transition, and how, if elected president, she would help with government initiatives and federal initiatives to help some of those communities that would be impacted severely by a transitionary economy, given the fact that fossil fuels seem to be at a tipping point.  Would you see that happening in Utah? Would you encourage that kind of cooperation with a new president?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: You know, I’m a small government guy.  You know, you’ve all heard the joke about the lies that are being told. And one of ‘em is, “I’m from the government, and I’m here to help ya.” It is a big lie. Government sometimes becomes the problem, not the solution.  And I think as we look throughout history we see where government, well-intended as it may be, get involved with the marketplace, it ends up tilting it in the wrong direction.  Ethanol, for example, again, the desire to have cleaner fuels, and it was embraced.

We all go to Iowa when we run for president. You’ve got to go there, and the farmers are a big constituency.  And yet, we have now a fuel that has a larger carbon footprint, that all it’s done is raise up the price of corn. Hurts us in Utah with our turkey industry, on our dairy industry.  So well-intended it was, it really has got the wrong outcome. I think some of the issues that we’ve done to try to spur the economy have been faulty.  So I’m reluctant to look to Washington to come in here and help us. Why don’t we just let the marketplace do what the marketplace does? That means coal is still viable.

Coal is a commodity that ought to be utilized, and particularly Utah coal. Utah coal has the qualities we want in a coal. It has high BTU. It burns hot. It has low sulfur content. It burns clean. There ought to be more Utah coal and less other kinds of coal.  So let the marketplace work.  Right now, the facts are, in this world today, when it comes to energy development, carbon-based fuels and/or nuclear power are gonna be the baseload for this world for a generation or more to come. 

Now, maybe with competition, new technologies—certainly, we’re transitioning to more natural gas because of hydraulic fracturing. Again, a technology that’s put us awash in natural gas.  That’s an example of the market competing out there and developing new energy sources.  And again, we know the public wants sustainable energy.  They want to have it affordable, and they want to have it cleaner. The marketplace will find answers to those three things if we’ll just let it. Keep the government out of it. 

ROBERT GEHRKE, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: But if I could kind of piggyback on that thought, the rural Utah is not experiencing some of the same benefits that you talked about that the rest of the state is. I mean, you’ve talked about the, you know, the economic growth, and the employment, and the education outcomes. But rural Utah has not really experienced any of that over the last 10 years. How do you bring them back onto par with the rest of the state? 

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, the market is what the market does.  And again, the biggest problem we face in many parts of rural Utah is the shrinking of the family farm and the ranch.  Where we used to have families and generations take over the farming and ranching, where it used to take 100 farmers to feed us, now it just takes 1 to feed us. And they’re kind of victims of the new technologies and the new yields, the bigger yields we have out there.

So we’ve got to reinvent what we do in rural Utah. Certainly, natural resource development, tourism and travel, have been a big part of that effort. We have a need to find maybe better communication, better access to technology, the opportunity to open up other opportunities of manufacturing and technology in our rural parts of Utah. We see where St. George and Washington County reinvented themselves by becoming the sunshine place, where they have a lot of recreation that’s taking place that’s attracting new manufacturing and businesses. So, again, I don’t know what they need to be.

But I expect that the local communities will understand what they have the potential to become, and they need to work with their local elected officials. The state has a role to help facilitate, but we’re not gonna dictate to them in rural Utah what they should be in the next generation. They can decide that for themselves. We’ll help them. And again, I’m certainly sympathetic and understand that every part of Utah is not as successful as we’d like it to become. And I won’t rest until all 29 counties, and all 243 cities, are robust and have a healthy economic opportunity. And not only for now, but for the rising generation. We do not want to have to export our children, even out of rural Utah. That’s not a good quality of life, exporting our children.  So that’s my number one focus, has been, will be, and will continue to be focus on growing the economy in all parts of our state.

MICHAEL ORTON, UTAHPOLITICALCAPITOL.COM: And you don’t see any participation by the federal government, in terms of infrastructure projects, or that kind of thing, to be able to lift our rural communities up? 

GOVERNOR HERBERT: I know that the federal government, we’re partners, and we have shared responsibilities on many areas.  But I would say this. I have two principles.  I’ve mentioned this to the new Speaker of the House, Paul Ryan.  I’ve mentioned to our Senior Senator, Orrin Hatch, here not too long ago.

“One, don’t take the money from us in the first place.  We don’t need any more programs.  We don’t think you’re efficient in how you spend the money back in Washington, D.C., so don’t take the money from us in the first place.

Secondly, if you do take the money, give it back to us in a block grant so we can develop our own programs, understanding our uniqueness of our demographics, our culture, our politics, and develop a program that fits our state.

We are tired of the one-size-fits-all approach that comes out of Washington, D.C.  That works for a few, but does not work for the many.  Don’t take the money from us in the first place. If you do take it, give it back to us and let us develop our own programs for our own needs.  That would be the better use of the taxpayers’ dollars.”

ROBERT GEHRKE, SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: Another topic that kind of touches on rural Utah is Rob Bishop’s Public Lands Initiative, which is already kind of drawing some criticism, both from the county commissioners and from environmental groups. How closely have you been involved in that, and are you a supporter of what is on the table at this point, including the national monument? 

GOVERNOR HERBERT: You know, I am supportive of Congressman Bishop’s effort. And I know Congressman Chaffetz is helping with that effort too. Compromise usually means that not everybody gets what they want on all sides of the issue. So I expect there’s some in the rural parts of Utah that say, “That’s not enough.”

And some in the environmental community thinks that’s not enough for their side.  That’s called “compromise.” But to be able to bring us together on 18 million acres of Utah where we’ve been fighting for, you know, since before Mike Leavitt, it’d be nice to reconcile at least part of it, and say, “How long are we gonna fight and do nothing?” Let’s preserve and protect those areas that need preservation.  Let’s open up for development those areas we have potential for energy and natural resource extraction, for tourism and travel. They are not mutually exclusive ideas. We can work together on this thing and move on to another day. Again, this constant state of flux and controversy is not healthy. So I applaud Congressman Bishop and Congressman Chaffetz in trying to bring us together and resolve this issue, at least for 18 million acres.

BEN WINSLOW, FOX-13: Do you support the creation of another national monument in Utah?

GOVERNOR HERBERT: You know, I’m not too happy about national monuments, but if that’s what it takes to get the compromise done so that everybody feels like they’ve got something out of this thing, that’s part of compromise. There are probably areas that how we treat it now, whether it was a national monument or not, would probably not even people know the difference. And so, you know, I’m certainly willing to entertain that possibility. I understand the necessity of compromise. And that’s what the Public Land Initiative is about.

ERIK NEILSEN, KUED: Governor, we have about a minute left.  This is the last news conference of 2015. I’m wondering if you’d—I’d like to give you the opportunity to reflect on 2015 and the upcoming holidays.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Well, thank you, 2015’s been a very successful year by any measurable, you know, grading system. Our economy now is the best in America. “Forbes” named us “The Best for Businesses and Careers” in America for the 5th time out of 6 years. The US Chamber of Commerce says that we’re, “The most fundamentally sound state in America when it comes to economics.” Art Laffer, the great economist said that our, “Outlook for the economy is the best in America.” So we have great reason to be grateful for what we’ve achieved. And looking forward with hope and optimism to the future. 

We’re doing things with education. We’re addressing our infrastructure needs, our needs to develop water. All those things are success.  So I’m really optimistic about the future. Let’s make sure we spend time in thanksgiving at Thanksgiving time. Let’s share the benefits with those who are less fortunate.  Our Christmas time, our celebrations, again, a great time to be grateful and hopeful for the new year.

ERIK NEILSEN, KUED: Governor, thank you for joining us.

GOVERNOR HERBERT: Thank you. 

Announcer: This has been “The Governor’s Monthly News Conference.” An archive of transcripts, video, and audio is available online. Please visit kued.org. Thanks for joining us.

 

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